FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE, WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON.With stuff like "lawful contact" and "reasonable attempt" and "practicable", it is no wonder that angry mobs have taken to the streets to protest and throw trash at police officers.
This is the first such instance of riotous mobs on American soil I can think of... in like... I dunno, 17 months or so. And these angry organizers say there are more to come. On May 1st, 2010, opponents of the new Arizona law intend to protest with a unified march on 70 different cities! This is how I thought up la gran idea...
So, according to U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE), the ultimate goal of their removal department is:
to develop the capacity to identify and remove all removable aliensThe Big Idea (la gran idea)
- ICE's Detention & Removal teams show up in the same 70 cities.
- Any protesters' presence is enough "reasonable suspicion" to ask for documentation.
- If they have legitimate I.D. allow them to enjoy their protest.
- If they do not, however, send them back to their countries of origin.
- Republicans and Democrats can blame me for this plan, because we all know both sides are too scared of upsetting Latino voters to make any kind of bold stand against illegal immigration.
13 comments:
I've said before how I have no love for illegals, but I do have a problem with this law.
I am uneasy when the government requires citizens to carry proof of citizenship at all times. It's a slightly fascist thing to do, and that isn't hyperbole.
The only valid forms are a birth certificate, passport, or naturalization papers. The average citizen (and in AZ the average citizen looks Mexican) will not be carrying their birth certificate wherever they go.
This law isn't going to reduce the number of illegals in AZ. It's going to create a new classification of people, citizens with paperwork on them, citizens without. The ones without get detained until the misunderstanding can be cleared up, costing the state money and wasting law enforcement resources.
This law is nothing more than a political stunt. It's ineffective at solving the real problem of illegal immigration, and will only increase the cost to the tax payer while detaining legal citizens.
I am surprised by your support of this measure. You are usually quick to notice wasteful political grandstanding on either side of the isle.
This law doesn't cost an extra penny.
And, if it is a political stunt, or grandstanding, it is for the purpose of drawing the federal government's attention (and resources) to a problem that has gone ignored too long.
Detention of people costs money and diverts resources, ie officers' time. AZ will end up spending far too much time and money in detaining lawful citizens, not to mention court costs from defending this ineffective law. The federal response will not be adequate enough to justify the cost.
This will do nothing but harm real efforts of immigration reform by making proponents seem xenophobic and racist.
You do know that FEDERAL law required all non-citizens to carry papers with them right? Meaning a greencard or visa papers must be on them at ALL times.
The issue should not be with Arizona's law, since they have every right as a State to do what they want. The issue should be the Federal governments failure to address the issue. They failed, forcing the State of Arizona to pick up the slack.
You also realize that you are upset at people being arrested for breaking the law, right?
...and your "real efforts of immigration reform" no doubt include amnesty. I will refer you to my previous post about immigration. You want to reward law breakers while further punishing those who comply with the law.
Liberals secret racism is coming out over this issue. You automatically assume illegal immigrant means Mexican. Did you know that 1 out of every 20 people caught at the US/Mexico border are not Mexican? You know quite a few of them are Middle Eastern?
Oh, and it won't cost any extra money. Hell, they probably won't even have to arrest anybody. It has already worked.
You should read what I've actually said instead of assuming my arguments. Let's count all the ways you're wrong.
"You do know that FEDERAL law required all non-citizens to carry papers with them right? Meaning a greencard or visa papers must be on them at ALL times. "
I do, and I have no problem with it. My problem is when the government requires citizens to carry papers proving their status. See, I said it right up there in my first post.
"You also realize that you are upset at people being arrested for breaking the law, right?"
No, I'm not. I'm upset about citizens being arrested and forced to prove they aren't breaking the law. Again, first post.
"...and your "real efforts of immigration reform" no doubt include amnesty. I will refer you to my previous post about immigration."
No, it doesn't. I will refer you to your previous post about immigration where I laid out my 3 point plan for immigration reform. One you agreed with.
"Liberals secret racism is coming out over this issue."
Now you just sound like a douche. Stop crying over liberals.
"Oh, and it won't cost any extra money. Hell, they probably won't even have to arrest anybody."
Then that's a pretty ineffective law. They're going to solve the illegal problem by not arresting and deporting a single person? That's some damn fine police work, Lou.
Next time, read my posts before arguing against them. It's no fun when you fail that miserably.
When you got pulled over for drunk driving, I am willing to bet the police officer's first sentence asked you for three forms of identification. The first to show your legal driving status, photo, name, current address, eye color, hair color, height (snicker snicker), and sex. The second to prove your legal ownership of the vehicle, whether you paid your registration, and whether your license plates belong on that vehicle. The third to prove you have current insurance on that particular vehicle.
So, in one sentence the police officer asks you for three forms of identification to see if you are breaking about 10 different laws...and that is even before he asks, "Son, have you been drinking tonight?"
Before now, if you were illegal you were allowed to break the law. The only thing that changed is one single State has begun enforcing pre-existing federal laws. They are required to enforce all other federal laws...so why not this one?
See, your entire argument is fucking stupid, which is why I ignored it the first time.
Oh, and my racist liberals comment stands strong. If it were not for the Democratic party, racism would be dead in this country. Your party's "la gran idea" of maintaining certain races in perpetual poverty to get continued voter support is not a secret.
Sigh. Your simplicity makes my head hurt sometimes. Let's try this once more.
Citizens of the US can only prove their legal status with a birth certificate or passport. Most don't carry these things around. This law is more likely to haul people to jail simply for not having papers on them. Thus it's a waste of time, money, and is political grandstanding.
Your drivers license argument is invalid. You have to have documentation to drive a car, but not to walk down the street. Until now.
There are far more effective ways to curb illegal immigration. As I've previously pointed out.
Your racist liberals argument has gone from sad to just stupid. Minorities don't vote. If they did we wouldn't have to pour tons of field resources into GOTV. Even in 95% DPI neighborhoods we can barely squeeze out a 2:1 plurality. Conspiracy theories make you look like a dipshit. Perhaps you should go back to playing with your trains.
Mountainman, I have said that about 5 times already.
P.S. Citizenship can be proven with a passport, or a birth certificate along with a state issued photo id, or with a state issued photo id and two other acceptable forms of identification, i.e. social security card, military id, etc. Shit you already carry in your wallet...or purse, if it suits you.
http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf
I need a birth certificate, county tax payment to get my driver's license an S.S. card to get paid, a visa to go to travel abroad, but we have people who do not think illegals should have to follow our laws. Any foreign national can become a U.S. citizen merely by applying and following the steps. Thing is, criminals from other countries would not be able to do this.
The dems know they've lost on the issues and have lost the American people. They just want some new voters. The Dems cannot win on the issues, they have to hide everything they do.
Why is it that anytime we try to enforce laws conservatives are called racists? But when Democrats take over the auto industry, the banks, the insurance company, require people to buy insurance they may not want, raise taxes, exact laws in violation of the U.S. constitution and defy the will of the American people why do they whine when we call them Socialists? That is socialism defined.
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